... the other Black experience
!!! AGAINST THE GRAIN: POST YOUR UNPOPULAR OPINIONS !!!
An all time great thread from the AP 1.0 foundation.
Massive props goes to the originator Onomatrix who brought us this powerful forum, inspired by by a forum on Playahata.com (if I'm correct). Ono, get on here and set it off with your unique perspective.
Objective: express the opinions that would normally get your run out of town if vocalized or presented. Example:
= Obama is not the best candidate but he's all we've got
= Black folks are our own worst enemy
= Women are too emotional
= Men are too emotionless
= Censorship is a good idea
= All women with perms hate their natural selves
= All men with dreads date white women
= Folks under 30 don't know anything about good music
= Chocolate owns vanilla
= J-Dilla couldn't touch Premeir, Large Pro, Pete Rock or Dre
...and so on (disclaimer: all the above examples do NOT represent my personal views, one or two maybe...).
This is not a place for full on debate & violent conflict, but please be free in how you express. And keep the page long flame-wars to private messages and off the boards.
Ready? Let's go!
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by kifaru on -
I'll second that. I seen Big Mama Jones and I'm pretty sure she was half white not half Indian like everybody says. In fact I'm kinda wondering if she was really my Great Grandmother. Blood relationships start to blur over time
and i know that a few of my "uncles" are actually my second cousins from my great uncle's family who got lynched down south.
leisuresuede said:*stands up & claps enthusiastically*
My mother's side of the family supposedly has Choctaw blood running through it but I have never had much confidence in its truth.
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Permalink Reply by X-D-D-M*9 on
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Massive respect L and K. My father told me a legend of an ancestor who was supposed to be Native American from North America (Canada or USA) who supposedly got with an African in South America and set off our clan. Great story but no substantial proof documented. Even heard folks say we're part East Indian 'cause Guyananese and have big noses; I think we need more evidence than that, ha.
I ain't brushing off these oral histories either. I understand that in most cases that's all we have when dealing with some African and Native American tradition and cultures, things get lost and changed for many significant reasons, often safety and forced. You can't just claim what you think is cool either without facts.
I've been interested in Native American cultures since my youth and would never disrespect them by reckless claims of heritage. It's funny and problematic to me that so many of our folks claim "Indian" genetics with no core facts because it's so exotic, cool & sexy and nobody will challenge them on it. Honestly I believe many African American people do have Native American genetic backgrounds and it would serve them to know as much of the true nationality and culture they come from, beyond being "cute" with it. We've heard the stories; there are better tools today to find out the (or some) truth.
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Permalink Reply by kifaru on
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I think that it is like the social phenomena you find in many cultures: desiring a prestige heritage. In Northern Sudan everybody is descended from Arabs and some from the Prophet Muhammad. It is idealized as having descended from an Arab father (read paternal ancestor) and an African mother (ancestress). The fact is there is Arab heritage in Sudan although not to the extent that people claim. However to accept that your african mother's brother was basically wiped out or marginalized reveals how much contempt that your Arab father had for your african ancestors. The same thing can be seen with Icelanders. The first thing Everybody there says is that they are descended from a viking. Nobody ever acknowledges the descent from the Irish slaves that the Vikings captured and used for labor even though the DNA studies show about a third of y and mtdna is of Celtic origin.
How does that relate to most of us New World Africans? We are kind of unique in the history of slavery in that we looked very different than our captors and that we were not absorbed into the greater population in a few generations. What that means is we visibly carry the stigma of a (former) slave/conquered population. To put in it perspective look at Europe. Almost all their populations in the Mediterranean but especially Italy were slaves but they carry no stigma. Race is not the glue of class as it is with us. Blacks in the America's had to come up with some way to explain why big mama was so light or why uncle Henry had that curly hair so we would not have to deal with the fact that big Mama was old master's half white daughter and her new master was raping her and that's how uncle Henry got that "good" hair. The solution:
"We's Indians!!!!"
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(stands and claps enthusiastically like L, pt. II) Worrrrd up! Thanks for the knowledge.
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Permalink Reply by Gadieon Artzuu on -
FUNNY AS ALL HELL! Alot of these self hating Blacks don;t have Indian blood in them. They have White Blood in them. Your mothers were raped and you have White blood in there some where. That's real talk.
X-D-D-M*9 said:(stolen from Bill Maher, shhh...)
= New Rule: All African-Americans claiming to be part "Indian" must now submit documented proof. If you are "part Indian on my mama's side, dat's where i got dis curly hair from.." then prove it through naming the exact nation that your "Indian"/1st Nation lineage comes from. Prove that ain't just hot-combed Carefree Curl...
Folks are throwing out the exotic-mixed-part-Indian card there and reaping all the ooo's & aaahhs without proper payment. And the Indians are pissed off. I spoke to Chief Runnin' Bullchips and he said he wants y'all negroes to stop. Y'all didn't stomp no Trail of Tears, y'all niggaz ain't real. If you ain't walked a mile in his moccasins, you can't reap the benefits.
So you came from the nation / continent of "Black", cool but borrrriiinnng. Well are you from India? Or are you Cherokee (disqualified, too general)? Blackfoot? Seminole? Nez Perce'? Mohegan? Taino? Azteck? Towanda? Watsikah? Tuskaroarah? Come on fam, make it authentic! You'll never be harrassed again. Imagine how hip you'll sound saying "I'm Black, Irish, Russian and Arapaho?
See how much cooler that sounds? Don't half-step, be a REAL genuine exotic negro, ladies & gents and claim you're dubious Indian heritage now!
[for $19.99 plus shipping & handling while supplies last...]
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^^^...and often there were hidden relationships that were consensual and even (oh God forbid) white women who had affairs & children with Black men! Aaaarrrgh! Not Peggy Sue, my virtuous daughter would never consort with likes of those savage beasts.
Hey Willie-Bob, I know how to keep white women away from those nigras: we'll start a rumour that they have tails and enormous dicks! That'll scare them away from those big ol' bucks; damn I'm a genius...
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This T-shirt...
...is corny as hell.
AfroPunk fam, I've been down with you from jump back in the ol' AP 1.0 with the original black background and when the Festival was about 30 of us chilling in Fort Greene Park eating watermelon slices. And back then, founder and inadvertant leader James Spooner embraced radical & innovative Hip Hop groups like Dead Prez, P.O.S., CX Kidtronik etc. having them perform and too many more the crossed mad styles & fashions expressing their "punk attitude" as Don Letts titled it.
So it's confusing & semi-annoying seeing that saying on an AP t-shirt when punk is supposed to encourage self-definition and sharing. If rap artists want to bring certain "punk" elements in, shouldn't that be allowed & promoted? Do you want rap artists to remain in the same 2-dimensional lane of cash, cars & chicks all day long?
Some of these judgemental hipsters need to dig up some photos & videos of Afrika Bambaataa, The Clash, B*A*D / Big Audo Dynamite, Malcolm McClaren, Grandmaster Flash & Furious Five, etc. and reeducate themselves on how much cultural exchange & unity true Hip Hop / rap and Punk had in ideals and fashion.
So chill out and let those rappers wear a studded jacket or Bad Brains t-shirt. It all belongs to everybody.
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Permalink Reply by kifaru on
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I tell cats this shit all the time but they won't acknowledge it. The scene that Hip Hop came up in was diverse. There have always been white cats involved in Hip hop and some where pioneers. White punks like Debbie Harry (remember New Wave was a way to make punk acceptable to the masses) helped make the art acceptable to white America. Remember Afrika Bambaataa, Soul sonic force, the furious five all dressed in spikes and leather? Punk and Hip hop are kissing cousins. One just happened to marry a white girl.
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^^^ Ha yeah, Fab 5 Freddie & Debbie Harry holding hands outside the Mudd, that's the shared culture. Malcolm McClaren said he first met Bambaataa when he saw walking down the street with with the Sex Pistols 'Never Mind The Bollocks' T-shirt on his massive torso & Malcolm told him "that's my group!". And Bam said "I love their music" and invited McClaren to the Bronx to check a Zulu Nation jam and that's all she wrote.
So don't feed me that corny-come-lately-this-belongs-to-us bullshit. Skaters/punks want to wear shelltoes, sagging pants, namerings etc. or go full on style like the Beastie boys, be my guest. And I'm going to futher call out the corny creators of this shirt in that they are clearly confused about the difference between Hip Hop culture and pop rap. "Party Like A Rock Star" with a snap/trap rapper wearing a Led Zep t-shirt does not represent Hip Hop music. There's a big chasm between real Hip Hop and it's elements and mainstream rap, do the knowledge.
© 2013 Created by Matthew.
