... the other Black experience
Do blacks have nothing to contribute to society?
One of my colleagues proposed the idea to me that on a vast scale, the modern black American culture has come to a rather complete halt regarding advancement in active “intellectual” progression, self-motivation, and personal responsibility. I would be rather intrigued to get some different thoughts and opinions on this notion. Does it hold some truth? Could this be a more broad ideology that expands to more American groups than just blacks? Or does it lean towards some kind of bias? Give me your ideas..
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by kifaru on -
I am of the opinion that black people do contribute a lot (positive) to society. There is a certain group of black people who do a lot to keep the negative perceptions of black people going. There's no shame in discussing these sorts of things rationally. You can be pretty sure that the people who can't discuss the negative aspects of blacks in society without going overboard are probably more closely aligned with the previously mentioned "certain group".
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Permalink Reply by Eris on -
Truthfully, I think a lot of attention is being drawn away from black scholars and students to make it seems like we AREN'T doing anything. What really bothers me about this however is when people assume that there is nothing in our CULTURE that is worth learning about and not just black american culture, I mean African culture as a whole.
This really hit a nerve when I was chatting with some people on an animation forum and we were talking about educational programs and how they are used in order to brodden a view of the kids who watch them (and their parents if they actually take the time to sit with them rather than plopping them in front of the set and leaving) What got to me was when someone stated that of all the 'minority cultures' (not my wording) out there, Blacks had the least to offer which is why we don't see a lot of educational children programming with black characters.
After a few other post, said person was BANNED but you get the point.
There are contributions and things to learn from our culture but as someone mentioned to me in the movie forum, this isn't something we can wait for others to do for us. We want to prove these people wrong, then we have to do it for ourselves because as we have seen, no one seems to be searching for our contributors yet people who do basic shit that doesn't really 'contribute' keep getting the attention, the money, and the praise. And yeah, most of the things will be tech/computer based but as I ask, even with all the hype what 'contributions' have actually HELPED people rather than just prove to be the groundings for another fad?
And another Harlem Renaissance is a pipe dream...but who's to say something similar can't happen?
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Permalink Reply by Compound Egret on -
Wow. is your colleague lighting a cross this evening or stewing in self hate?
What's the hard and fast definition of "modern black american culture"? The "culture" argument falls flat immediately. If that was true, I wouldn't see white kids rapping high speed midwest style on TMobile commercials, or the pop charts dominated by mutations of house music. Has your colleague ever heard of Oprah Winfrey?
was your buddy really asking (in a REALLY rude way)why aren't there more Black banks? Why Koreans sell so many hair products in our community? Where's the Black supermarket? That's stuff I wonder about, but at this point have little control over. The first step in any of that is getting your own house in order and that's my main focus.
Jamail Larkins is a great example of all the things you mentioned. As some of the other people mentioned, these people are out there if you look.
http://www.inc.com/30under30/2009/profile_ascension_aircraft.html
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Permalink Reply by angie1340 on -
In regard of the theorie of the 100th monkey, perhaps, that in the black American mixed culture, there is something to increase critical mass to change the world and finally access to higher global conscience level?
Yes!! Rock on !!!
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Permalink Reply by angie1340 on
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+ if you don't already know about this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hundredth_monkey_effect
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Permalink Reply by angie1340 on
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It's not about monkeys it's about conscience. It's just a metaphor, sorry if I vexed someone, it's not really official science ether.
if you study Paganism or alchemy or whatever astrology, toism, etc you'll find those kind of logics.
it's about finding simple ideas that makes life better, and make it grow?
Our values are the key.
sorry but in you reaction I feel as if I show you the moon and you watch my finger.
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Permalink Reply by AfroCuban on -
I think there are many American Black folk doing just what you recall as positive. The difference now is that there are no communication networks to spread the word, get everyone in line, and allowing people to give and receive various types of support (emotional, intellectual, financial, bartering).
There are many websites, twitter feeds, yadda, yadda, but you only see (often broken) strands here and there, not the web. I recall, when young, someone asked me if I was going to such and such. I told my mom and she told me there was a Civil Rights organizing meeting happening somewhere. I'm sure she learned that from word of mouth.
If you can't walk down the street and have complete strangers pass acknowledge you and share info. on happenings, there is no network.
People are far, far spread out. The potential exists for a "zeitgeist", but there is the foregone conclusion of subversion, sabotage, and surveillance by "anti-Black/anti-minority" groups who can get the same info.
It's the "zeitgeist" that sparks and moves the community. There is no community. Whereas, "all" people melded into one community. People like to keep themselves separated, physically, intellectually, and culturally, though they are all Black.
Find a way to start a perpetual viral expansion loop of "Black" community progression, motivation, and personal responsibility, and you will be on the level of Marcus Garvey and Malcolm X.
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Permalink Reply by Eris on
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I think what you said shows the importance of what we consider 'staying connected' with each other.
With all the social media that we have at our fingers tips, people are stilling finding it 'hard to find' black people making a contribution to this world? I guess it could be argued that maybe we spend too much time on social networks doing nothing and not enough time in the real world where things really matter and missing what everyone is doing.
There really is a lot of communication in the real world that can help show is where all the positive things are. Not everyone has the ability to be on Twitter, Facebook and everywhere else at all times and the fact that somethings are being missed because its NOT on these sites speaks words to how we communicate with each other now. There really is no connection as there is a disconnect because we can no longer talk to each other UNLESS we have accounts somewhere else....in that sense, we can actually miss seeing the contributions we do make but because its not high-lighted on all the so-called social networks, its not important to the eyes of many.
Then again, it can be argued that if some of these people did have access to these networks, more would be spread around but I always argue the fact of why not continue to use BOTH means of communication? Wouldn't it alert more people, especially those who do not have complete access, and allow them to see what is going on and happening? More ground is covered and we don't limit ourselves in the process.
Sorry for hijacking the thread on this but I had to speak up about this. :P
But yeah, there are contributions being made and I'm very happy to see them. What makes me sad is that people tend to ignore this and with that lack of knowledge, they use it as a means of spreading more ignorance to what people do. They just want another excuse to sound like smug assholes when trying to compare one group to another and then base the value on said people on this.
The old grandmother that was able to raise enough money to start a library reading program contributed more than the random Youtube dumbass who rammed his nuts into his door and got 1,000,000x hits and a guest star on some shitty show.
AfroCuban said:
I think there are many American Black folk doing just what you recall as positive. The difference now is that there are no communication networks to spread the word, get everyone in line, and allowing people to give and receive various types of support (emotional, intellectual, financial, bartering).
There are many websites, twitter feeds, yadda, yadda, but you only see (often broken) strands here and there, not the web. I recall, when young, someone asked me if I was going to such and such. I told my mom and she told me there was a Civil Rights organizing meeting happening somewhere. I'm sure she learned that from word of mouth.
If you can't walk down the street and have complete strangers pass acknowledge you and share info. on happenings, there is no network.
People are far, far spread out. The potential exists for a "zeitgeist", but there is the foregone conclusion of subversion, sabotage, and surveillance by "anti-Black/anti-minority" groups who can get the same info.
It's the "zeitgeist" that sparks and moves the community. There is no community. Whereas, "all" people melded into one community. People like to keep themselves separated, physically, intellectually, and culturally, though they are all Black.
Find a way to start a perpetual viral expansion loop of "Black" community progression, motivation, and personal responsibility, and you will be on the level of Marcus Garvey and Malcolm X.
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Permalink Reply by AfroCuban on
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Yes, communication and passing on of knowledge has to be in person and online. And it's true many people aren't online, because they can't or because they don't want to. Things have changed. A lot.
There are people doing things all over the place. But I don't know how you'd find out about the all. Maybe my searching is incorrect, or maybe not in depth and in breadth enough. Maybe, I expect it to be easy and give up too soon.
What you said about the Youtube nuts dumb-asses is true. That gets tons of attention, and always sports, and the lady that saved her whole life gets ignored.
Stuff is backwards and upside down.
Eris said:
I think what you said shows the importance of what we consider 'staying connected' with each other.
With all the social media that we have at our fingers tips, people are stilling finding it 'hard to find' black people making a contribution to this world? I guess it could be argued that maybe we spend too much time on social networks doing nothing and not enough time in the real world where things really matter and missing what everyone is doing.
There really is a lot of communication in the real world that can help show is where all the positive things are. Not everyone has the ability to be on Twitter, Facebook and everywhere else at all times and the fact that somethings are being missed because its NOT on these sites speaks words to how we communicate with each other now. There really is no connection as there is a disconnect because we can no longer talk to each other UNLESS we have accounts somewhere else....in that sense, we can actually miss seeing the contributions we do make but because its not high-lighted on all the so-called social networks, its not important to the eyes of many.
Then again, it can be argued that if some of these people did have access to these networks, more would be spread around but I always argue the fact of why not continue to use BOTH means of communication? Wouldn't it alert more people, especially those who do not have complete access, and allow them to see what is going on and happening? More ground is covered and we don't limit ourselves in the process.
Sorry for hijacking the thread on this but I had to speak up about this. :P
But yeah, there are contributions being made and I'm very happy to see them. What makes me sad is that people tend to ignore this and with that lack of knowledge, they use it as a means of spreading more ignorance to what people do. They just want another excuse to sound like smug assholes when trying to compare one group to another and then base the value on said people on this.
The old grandmother that was able to raise enough money to start a library reading program contributed more than the random Youtube dumbass who rammed his nuts into his door and got 1,000,000x hits and a guest star on some shitty show.
AfroCuban said:
I think there are many American Black folk doing just what you recall as positive. The difference now is that there are no communication networks to spread the word, get everyone in line, and allowing people to give and receive various types of support (emotional, intellectual, financial, bartering).
There are many websites, twitter feeds, yadda, yadda, but you only see (often broken) strands here and there, not the web. I recall, when young, someone asked me if I was going to such and such. I told my mom and she told me there was a Civil Rights organizing meeting happening somewhere. I'm sure she learned that from word of mouth.
If you can't walk down the street and have complete strangers pass acknowledge you and share info. on happenings, there is no network.
People are far, far spread out. The potential exists for a "zeitgeist", but there is the foregone conclusion of subversion, sabotage, and surveillance by "anti-Black/anti-minority" groups who can get the same info.
It's the "zeitgeist" that sparks and moves the community. There is no community. Whereas, "all" people melded into one community. People like to keep themselves separated, physically, intellectually, and culturally, though they are all Black.
Find a way to start a perpetual viral expansion loop of "Black" community progression, motivation, and personal responsibility, and you will be on the level of Marcus Garvey and Malcolm X.
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Permalink Reply by Eris on
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Maybe finding them ALL is a bit too much but it is satisfying to find the things you have been looking for and proving those wrong, case in point the subject of this entire thread. There are plenty of contributions going on out there but as many have stated even before I made my comments, because we live in a racist and seemingly unintrested society, the people who actually do good things for others are ignored while the dog-and-pony show brigade are treated as some sort of statement for the ages (and sadly, THAT statement is NOT positive, :P )
I won't go on a tangent about people ignoring but it all has to do with the fact that now communication seems to come at a price. Word of mouth can be free and informing which is why people should not ditch it and continue to use it when you want more info to be spread. A lot of people don't have the money to buy iPhones, iPads, but that doesn't mean they should be left out. :P
AfroCuban said:Yes, communication and passing on of knowledge has to be in person and online. And it's true many people aren't online, because they can't or because they don't want to. Things have changed. A lot.
There are people doing things all over the place. But I don't know how you'd find out about the all. Maybe my searching is incorrect, or maybe not in depth and in breadth enough. Maybe, I expect it to be easy and give up too soon.
What you said about the Youtube nuts dumb-asses is true. That gets tons of attention, and always sports, and the lady that saved her whole life gets ignored.
Stuff is backwards and upside down.
Eris said:
I think what you said shows the importance of what we consider 'staying connected' with each other.
With all the social media that we have at our fingers tips, people are stilling finding it 'hard to find' black people making a contribution to this world? I guess it could be argued that maybe we spend too much time on social networks doing nothing and not enough time in the real world where things really matter and missing what everyone is doing.
There really is a lot of communication in the real world that can help show is where all the positive things are. Not everyone has the ability to be on Twitter, Facebook and everywhere else at all times and the fact that somethings are being missed because its NOT on these sites speaks words to how we communicate with each other now. There really is no connection as there is a disconnect because we can no longer talk to each other UNLESS we have accounts somewhere else....in that sense, we can actually miss seeing the contributions we do make but because its not high-lighted on all the so-called social networks, its not important to the eyes of many.
Then again, it can be argued that if some of these people did have access to these networks, more would be spread around but I always argue the fact of why not continue to use BOTH means of communication? Wouldn't it alert more people, especially those who do not have complete access, and allow them to see what is going on and happening? More ground is covered and we don't limit ourselves in the process.
Sorry for hijacking the thread on this but I had to speak up about this. :P
But yeah, there are contributions being made and I'm very happy to see them. What makes me sad is that people tend to ignore this and with that lack of knowledge, they use it as a means of spreading more ignorance to what people do. They just want another excuse to sound like smug assholes when trying to compare one group to another and then base the value on said people on this.
The old grandmother that was able to raise enough money to start a library reading program contributed more than the random Youtube dumbass who rammed his nuts into his door and got 1,000,000x hits and a guest star on some shitty show.
AfroCuban said:
I think there are many American Black folk doing just what you recall as positive. The difference now is that there are no communication networks to spread the word, get everyone in line, and allowing people to give and receive various types of support (emotional, intellectual, financial, bartering).
There are many websites, twitter feeds, yadda, yadda, but you only see (often broken) strands here and there, not the web. I recall, when young, someone asked me if I was going to such and such. I told my mom and she told me there was a Civil Rights organizing meeting happening somewhere. I'm sure she learned that from word of mouth.
If you can't walk down the street and have complete strangers pass acknowledge you and share info. on happenings, there is no network.
People are far, far spread out. The potential exists for a "zeitgeist", but there is the foregone conclusion of subversion, sabotage, and surveillance by "anti-Black/anti-minority" groups who can get the same info.
It's the "zeitgeist" that sparks and moves the community. There is no community. Whereas, "all" people melded into one community. People like to keep themselves separated, physically, intellectually, and culturally, though they are all Black.
Find a way to start a perpetual viral expansion loop of "Black" community progression, motivation, and personal responsibility, and you will be on the level of Marcus Garvey and Malcolm X.
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Permalink Reply by AfroCuban on
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Agree.
Whole-heartedly.
Eris said:Maybe finding them ALL is a bit too much but it is satisfying to find the things you have been looking for and proving those wrong, case in point the subject of this entire thread. There are plenty of contributions going on out there but as many have stated even before I made my comments, because we live in a racist and seemingly unintrested society, the people who actually do good things for others are ignored while the dog-and-pony show brigade are treated as some sort of statement for the ages (and sadly, THAT statement is NOT positive, :P )
I won't go on a tangent about people ignoring but it all has to do with the fact that now communication seems to come at a price. Word of mouth can be free and informing which is why people should not ditch it and continue to use it when you want more info to be spread. A lot of people don't have the money to buy iPhones, iPads, but that doesn't mean they should be left out. :P
AfroCuban said:Yes, communication and passing on of knowledge has to be in person and online. And it's true many people aren't online, because they can't or because they don't want to. Things have changed. A lot.
There are people doing things all over the place. But I don't know how you'd find out about the all. Maybe my searching is incorrect, or maybe not in depth and in breadth enough. Maybe, I expect it to be easy and give up too soon.
What you said about the Youtube nuts dumb-asses is true. That gets tons of attention, and always sports, and the lady that saved her whole life gets ignored.
Stuff is backwards and upside down.
Eris said:
I think what you said shows the importance of what we consider 'staying connected' with each other.
With all the social media that we have at our fingers tips, people are stilling finding it 'hard to find' black people making a contribution to this world? I guess it could be argued that maybe we spend too much time on social networks doing nothing and not enough time in the real world where things really matter and missing what everyone is doing.
There really is a lot of communication in the real world that can help show is where all the positive things are. Not everyone has the ability to be on Twitter, Facebook and everywhere else at all times and the fact that somethings are being missed because its NOT on these sites speaks words to how we communicate with each other now. There really is no connection as there is a disconnect because we can no longer talk to each other UNLESS we have accounts somewhere else....in that sense, we can actually miss seeing the contributions we do make but because its not high-lighted on all the so-called social networks, its not important to the eyes of many.
Then again, it can be argued that if some of these people did have access to these networks, more would be spread around but I always argue the fact of why not continue to use BOTH means of communication? Wouldn't it alert more people, especially those who do not have complete access, and allow them to see what is going on and happening? More ground is covered and we don't limit ourselves in the process.
Sorry for hijacking the thread on this but I had to speak up about this. :P
But yeah, there are contributions being made and I'm very happy to see them. What makes me sad is that people tend to ignore this and with that lack of knowledge, they use it as a means of spreading more ignorance to what people do. They just want another excuse to sound like smug assholes when trying to compare one group to another and then base the value on said people on this.
The old grandmother that was able to raise enough money to start a library reading program contributed more than the random Youtube dumbass who rammed his nuts into his door and got 1,000,000x hits and a guest star on some shitty show.
AfroCuban said:
I think there are many American Black folk doing just what you recall as positive. The difference now is that there are no communication networks to spread the word, get everyone in line, and allowing people to give and receive various types of support (emotional, intellectual, financial, bartering).
There are many websites, twitter feeds, yadda, yadda, but you only see (often broken) strands here and there, not the web. I recall, when young, someone asked me if I was going to such and such. I told my mom and she told me there was a Civil Rights organizing meeting happening somewhere. I'm sure she learned that from word of mouth.
If you can't walk down the street and have complete strangers pass acknowledge you and share info. on happenings, there is no network.
People are far, far spread out. The potential exists for a "zeitgeist", but there is the foregone conclusion of subversion, sabotage, and surveillance by "anti-Black/anti-minority" groups who can get the same info.
It's the "zeitgeist" that sparks and moves the community. There is no community. Whereas, "all" people melded into one community. People like to keep themselves separated, physically, intellectually, and culturally, though they are all Black.
Find a way to start a perpetual viral expansion loop of "Black" community progression, motivation, and personal responsibility, and you will be on the level of Marcus Garvey and Malcolm X.
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Permalink Reply by angie1340 on
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From Marcus Garvey's Negro World to Philip Emeagwali's super computer, there are so much examples of "managing the adversity", with goodwill and positive energy. Perhaps it's a question of commitment.
I deeply think that if something happen, it will be the fact of women, look at Angela Davis, but also to Africa. African women are, in lots of countries, the real economic forces and the vector of political changes.
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