... the other Black experience
Recently I told James Spooner he was the Black Malcolm McLaren
Turns out he left & turned over AP to somebody else and THAT's when it started turning into Toyotapunk. This is pretty much the whole Facebook convo. The rest was irrelevant to the topic. Also I'm bipolar so expect some rambling:
ok. but i wonder if yu really feel like that for some reason?
what was that message all about?
oops... got too high
ok. but i wonder if yu really feel like that for some reason?
Just for the record I havent been involved with afropunk since it went
toyota .
james
toyota .
james
You're the Black Malcolm McLaren to me man. I started thinking that as soon as I saw those ads...but on the other hand, I think AP had a
hugely unsung role in pushing society to accept Black people being into
things besides our template. So it "balanced out" in my eyes.
I just whine because the punk scene that was already in existence since
before we were born was the one who taught so many of us kids the DIY
ethic, that it was ok to be ourselves regardless of race, etc...not
Toyota, not our parents, not these mainstream mohawk/hipster/scene etc,
sheep either. In my eyes, you went to Africa, said "WTF?? I'm not Black
enough?"...then you made a great Black documentary, then went "fuck punk
rock it's not Black enough". It wouldn't be Mexican enough either if
the fucking kids didn't come into the fucking scene, but they do, so
there's plenty for them there...in the authentic, cheap, multicultural,
resourceful, all-ages, DIY punk scene. But a private company making a
mini-scene, and herding us to it made a lot more sense in my American
born eyes. "Ah yes, another fucking "cracker"(the real meaning not the
newer slur) to tell us po' lil' Black folk where to go & what to do
in YET ANOTHER box...oh it's 'set apart' from the punk scene? well that
must be cause I'm so special...the other punk scene wouldn't know what
to do with my Black ass! I'll settle for my little scene then &
rejoice" (cue old spirituals)
fucking BRUJERIA, LOS CRUDOS, THE HATERZ, LUTA ARMADA, BAD BRAINS, and especially in our case PURE
HELL...you getting me? ain't had my meds yet & starting to not make
sense, but anyway, yeah that was my image of you. you're saying that's
not accurate?
PS I didn't tell you cause I didn't wanna discourage you from doing more of your good films & shit or working with these ex-shut-in Black
rockers.
you know how nice I am when I'm not hitting people.
You do good work, just the "trip to Africa trauma" story in old interviews
combined with the separatism and corporate ads blazing on AP painted a
weird picture.
hugely unsung role in pushing society to accept Black people being into
things besides our template. So it "balanced out" in my eyes.
I just whine because the punk scene that was already in existence since
before we were born was the one who taught so many of us kids the DIY
ethic, that it was ok to be ourselves regardless of race, etc...not
Toyota, not our parents, not these mainstream mohawk/hipster/scene etc,
sheep either. In my eyes, you went to Africa, said "WTF?? I'm not Black
enough?"...then you made a great Black documentary, then went "fuck punk
rock it's not Black enough". It wouldn't be Mexican enough either if
the fucking kids didn't come into the fucking scene, but they do, so
there's plenty for them there...in the authentic, cheap, multicultural,
resourceful, all-ages, DIY punk scene. But a private company making a
mini-scene, and herding us to it made a lot more sense in my American
born eyes. "Ah yes, another fucking "cracker"(the real meaning not the
newer slur) to tell us po' lil' Black folk where to go & what to do
in YET ANOTHER box...oh it's 'set apart' from the punk scene? well that
must be cause I'm so special...the other punk scene wouldn't know what
to do with my Black ass! I'll settle for my little scene then &
rejoice" (cue old spirituals)
fucking BRUJERIA, LOS CRUDOS, THE HATERZ, LUTA ARMADA, BAD BRAINS, and especially in our case PURE
HELL...you getting me? ain't had my meds yet & starting to not make
sense, but anyway, yeah that was my image of you. you're saying that's
not accurate?
PS I didn't tell you cause I didn't wanna discourage you from doing more of your good films & shit or working with these ex-shut-in Black
rockers.
you know how nice I am when I'm not hitting people.
You do good work, just the "trip to Africa trauma" story in old interviews
combined with the separatism and corporate ads blazing on AP painted a
weird picture.
The thing is bro , I left afropunk the company the same year it got corporate sponsorship. so I have nothing to do with that.
And for better or worse when I was doing 5 dollar afropunk shows about 200 people would come out. I could pay the bands and I was making money to pay rent. Now literally thosands of people come to the fest because its free the bands get paid more but there was actually more money to be made in the diy model. That's in the short term anyway. There was actually more money to be made in the diy model. That in the short term anyway.
all that said, Im just a dude trying to make art. Afropunk became a
business, so I bounced. Id rather struggle to make ar than struggle to
make money.
james
ps. it was st. lucia not africa and I appreciate your roll in getting the community started.
And for better or worse when I was doing 5 dollar afropunk shows about 200 people would come out. I could pay the bands and I was making money to pay rent. Now literally thosands of people come to the fest because its free the bands get paid more but there was actually more money to be made in the diy model. That's in the short term anyway. There was actually more money to be made in the diy model. That in the short term anyway.
all that said, Im just a dude trying to make art. Afropunk became a
business, so I bounced. Id rather struggle to make ar than struggle to
make money.
james
ps. it was st. lucia not africa and I appreciate your roll in getting the community started.
well most people are assholes...I'm glad to see you didn't go down that road. As far as I'm concerned like I said, AP had a hugely
unsung role in one of my big life goals getting partially accomplished.
Otherwise it was like saving the whales. EVENTUALLY it would have, but
not this fast, where I would be young enough to enjoy it. (Even though
we still got a ways to go for acceptance, kids have more freedom &
get less beat-downs now over that shit) MTV, BET and the other
corporations didn't give a shit. I thought YOU had turned into one of
those guys...you know, the guys who run "BLACK Entertainment Television"
while excluding all this Black music we listen to. ON PURPOSE, YEAR
AFTER YEAR.
That's great to know though that you handed it off & that's where all the McLaren bullshit came in. Regardless, even
thinking you had just become another capitalist severing ties from his
past & looking out for number one, I still appreciated YOUR work.
As far as the guy running AP now, he's not you. I don't give a shit why he
does what he does. As far as I know he wasn't even one of us (a Black
kid from the DIY punk scene). Who is this guy? Don't even tell me cause I
don't care. The end justified the means enough for me just to be happy
it's there...if it goes Disney it goes Disney, but as far as our battles
to dispell a little conservative ignorance the "damage" is done. A lot
more people know we exist now. They can no longer claim we dont &
use that to violate our rights to physical safety & lifestyle
choices based on the color of our skin without acknowledging they're a
dumbass. That doesn't go for everybody, but it was witnessed by enough
people that it changed society. People can say I'm exagerrating but I
don't think I am. I think AP did this. I think if you hadn't bought that
camera, the fucking poser mohawks on the gangsters, etc...none of that
shit would have happened. It ended up being more good than bad, just
like I thought it would when I was dreaming as a teenager.
As far as the Africa comment I apologize. I only meant it *strictly in the
context of my perception* of you still being at the helm of AP running
it like a wannabe "AOL" (exaggeration) like I explained...not what
you're doing in reality now. We all got scars, but I thought with the
facts I had...that what you had done was go to Africa, say "I'm not
Black enough?" then come back...use DIY and what not you learned as a
youth to start a GOOD project, THEN to separate instead of unifylater,
after goading and absorbing some of the more conservative (albiet
misfit) fans words on tour; doing a good thing while doing an ignorant
thing, then becoming a hipster CEO to boot. If it's one thing I can't
stand, it's hipster CEOs. But I digress. Hope I make sense cause u know
with this bipolar I can never really tell. Anyway to finish up
Now that you're telling me that's NOT the case I'm happy as hell. You know
that saying about punk rockers...something like "they say they don't
care about anything because they actually care too much" somethin like
that.
unsung role in one of my big life goals getting partially accomplished.
Otherwise it was like saving the whales. EVENTUALLY it would have, but
not this fast, where I would be young enough to enjoy it. (Even though
we still got a ways to go for acceptance, kids have more freedom &
get less beat-downs now over that shit) MTV, BET and the other
corporations didn't give a shit. I thought YOU had turned into one of
those guys...you know, the guys who run "BLACK Entertainment Television"
while excluding all this Black music we listen to. ON PURPOSE, YEAR
AFTER YEAR.
That's great to know though that you handed it off & that's where all the McLaren bullshit came in. Regardless, even
thinking you had just become another capitalist severing ties from his
past & looking out for number one, I still appreciated YOUR work.
As far as the guy running AP now, he's not you. I don't give a shit why he
does what he does. As far as I know he wasn't even one of us (a Black
kid from the DIY punk scene). Who is this guy? Don't even tell me cause I
don't care. The end justified the means enough for me just to be happy
it's there...if it goes Disney it goes Disney, but as far as our battles
to dispell a little conservative ignorance the "damage" is done. A lot
more people know we exist now. They can no longer claim we dont &
use that to violate our rights to physical safety & lifestyle
choices based on the color of our skin without acknowledging they're a
dumbass. That doesn't go for everybody, but it was witnessed by enough
people that it changed society. People can say I'm exagerrating but I
don't think I am. I think AP did this. I think if you hadn't bought that
camera, the fucking poser mohawks on the gangsters, etc...none of that
shit would have happened. It ended up being more good than bad, just
like I thought it would when I was dreaming as a teenager.
As far as the Africa comment I apologize. I only meant it *strictly in the
context of my perception* of you still being at the helm of AP running
it like a wannabe "AOL" (exaggeration) like I explained...not what
you're doing in reality now. We all got scars, but I thought with the
facts I had...that what you had done was go to Africa, say "I'm not
Black enough?" then come back...use DIY and what not you learned as a
youth to start a GOOD project, THEN to separate instead of unifylater,
after goading and absorbing some of the more conservative (albiet
misfit) fans words on tour; doing a good thing while doing an ignorant
thing, then becoming a hipster CEO to boot. If it's one thing I can't
stand, it's hipster CEOs. But I digress. Hope I make sense cause u know
with this bipolar I can never really tell. Anyway to finish up
Now that you're telling me that's NOT the case I'm happy as hell. You know
that saying about punk rockers...something like "they say they don't
care about anything because they actually care too much" somethin like
that.
Shit, I am who I am only because of the kind of thinking that made you put everything including your reputation and livelyhood on the
line to move a few more steps forward in the American civil rights war.
The one people claim is over, while continuing to hold us down.
So it ain't that I was all like "FUCK James!". I was more just annoyed
that I thought you sold out the same people you claimed solidarity with
& stabbed us in the back...punk rockers AND Black rockers, so on the
one hand I went "aw hell naw", and on the other hand I went
"wellllllllll...you know what though? we're still a lot better off now,
let him do his thing". (that's the problem with being somewhat famous
James...your rep grows with or without your input, or you even actually
being there)
ps. Thanks a lot for taking away my satisfaction of calling out a McLaren. xD
line to move a few more steps forward in the American civil rights war.
The one people claim is over, while continuing to hold us down.
So it ain't that I was all like "FUCK James!". I was more just annoyed
that I thought you sold out the same people you claimed solidarity with
& stabbed us in the back...punk rockers AND Black rockers, so on the
one hand I went "aw hell naw", and on the other hand I went
"wellllllllll...you know what though? we're still a lot better off now,
let him do his thing". (that's the problem with being somewhat famous
James...your rep grows with or without your input, or you even actually
being there)
ps. Thanks a lot for taking away my satisfaction of calling out a McLaren. xD
haha. thanks. well spread the word. just let the people who were there with us in
the beginning know I am the same dude I always was. And its for that
reason they dont hear from me on the site any more."
From the horses mouth, to anybody who gives a shit.
{edited slightly to save James some grief, but nothin important}
the beginning know I am the same dude I always was. And its for that
reason they dont hear from me on the site any more."
From the horses mouth, to anybody who gives a shit.
{edited slightly to save James some grief, but nothin important}
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Obsidian on -
Been waiting for "this post" to finally surface. Ah answers ... from the Lithium Sage of dimensional distortion and jolly rancher rage.
-
Permalink Reply by Mark Clemons on
-
This Comes as a LowBlow to Me.
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