Coming Out, Being Out, or Deciding Not to Be...

What's up, you nasty black creatures of sin.
Let's start talking about something on here. Wanna?

Got into a DEEP discussion with some friends of mine (all black, all queer) about the politics of coming out. One of my friends was talking about how her little sister (who IDs as bisexual) finds power in being queer on the DL and choosing carefully where, when and with whom she decides to be out. She doesn't see what the big deal is about being out all the time and also feels that white people within LGBTQ communities have dominated the discussion on out-ness and have promoted the idea that being out = being liberated. I was wondering what you all think about this. How out are you? Do you find power in not being out in certain spaces? Or do you feel that in spaces where you aren't out, you feel like you're having to keep your sexuality a secret, and this is oppressive to you?

I am out to all of my family and friends but I am not out at work. I am a substitute teacher and, even though I have had a child come up to me and tell me that she is gay, I didn't feel at liberty to share my sexuality with her because I thought I could get in trouble. I did tell her that it was totally fine to be gay, though, and that made us both feel pretty good. I personally feel like not being out makes me feel like I am hiding away a part of my identity that I really am proud of because I'm scared of what the reaction might be. When I worked at a black coffee shop in Portland, there were a lot of Black Muslims that would come in there and the general vibe of the stores was subtly homophobic. I wasn't out in that space either because I didn't feel safe.

Please share your stories!

Tags: being out, black queers, coming out, downlow

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Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Lex on March 3, 2009 at 2:11pm

Thanks for writing this Osa. I think this is really a complicated issue. I agree with your friend that white folks have dominated the discussion on what it means to be out and what it means to be queer (and all other conversations...that's how white supremacy works right?) And I also think that a black queer folks we have to navigate the world differently than other folks with other privileges do. Immigration status, class standing, work environments and personal safety influence how "out" we can be at any given moment, right?

I know because my gender performance is basically femme I am not as "out" as at any given moment as my girlfriend is because she is visibly masculine in her appearance. And my "outness" shifts when I am with her, not only because she is visibly queer, but also because I am super affectionate with her almost all of the time (can't help it. she's so delicious!)

I am out to family and everyone who I know and work with, but at the program where I volunteer (also a teaching environment) I am quiet about my sexuality with certain folks which is difficult for me because it is a very homophobic environment and while I am constantly fighting the homophobia there (which is mostly anti-gay male homophobia) I also don't feel safe to have some blatant coming out moment there. Which is a sacrifice. And a damn shame. I really relate to what you are saying. I am totally afraid of what the reaction from some particularly homophobic authority figures there would be. I don't think everyone should have to be completely out at every moment to be true to themselves, but I do think that we should be able to be our whole selves in the ways we want to...when we want to. I think this requires some community-wide work though to make shared mixed spaces safer for us to be who we are. I know if the school I work at isn't safe for ME to come out all the time it isn't DEFINITELY safely nuturing the kids to be themselves either...you know?

I think sharing these stories is really helpful though. Thanks for starting it up!

Permalink Reply by Kaos Blac on March 3, 2009 at 6:18pm

I can agree with the sister on some levels. I dont feel the big deal with being out all the time. Also i agree with the idea that White people tend to try to corner the market on gayness, its acceptable by them , ie ellen, but for black folk its such a taboo. I'm only out with Friends that i know. I don't feel safe sometimes just talking my business everywhere I go.

My family is from the Caribbean and its not tolerated at all. I asked my gay older cousin that i wanted to come out to the family but he said it was best just to leave it alone and not stir up any headless emotion. Out here in NYC it all depend where you live. personally i live in teh hood and i get enough grief for my tight jeans and "matrix" jackets, but its more lax now since everybody is wearing skinny jeans. Like its a cultural disease on person wears them and I get kids in coming into my retail job, I mean hood rats going "yo son ya'll got skinnies?" , lol.

Great topic Osa.

Permalink Reply by Caz Prescott on March 5, 2009 at 10:16pm

In my case, I find that I can be more out to white people than black people. I used to live in Flatbush, a notoriously anti-gay 'hood. I was always worried that if I ever got a girlfriend that we'd be gaybashed, raped or killed. There were some trangender/drag queens that lived in our 'hood in the 70s & 80s. One of our neighbors was flaming & as far as I know, he was never bashed, only stabbed by his lover in a fight.

I thought I would go the route of writing my mommy a letter letting her know that I'm bi. Once in therapy she admitted that she already knew, since I was a kid. Whew! What a relief! Nobody else in my family knows though.

I only tell people about me when the subject of sexuality comes up, which is not very often. I have a few homo/biphobic friends; luckily they don't give me a hard time about being openly queer. I've been in demos & pride marches where I've been photographed. For some reason I don't worry about the outcome of my face plastered all over a newspaper article. But on the other hand I still fear for my safety.

Permalink Reply by Madamoiselle De Sade on March 5, 2009 at 11:13pm

My family is very old school southern, baptist church and when I came out they sent me to a preacher and had them drip holy water on me.
I can't be out there, they just ignore it. Cause it totally didn't happen and isn't happening now! :P I totally resent the whole thing.

I don't find much opportunity to be out because no one can tell I'm bi. But when I am in a pride atmosphere I feel more comfortable, tho I have been bi bashed at least 2 times.
I don't feel like walking up to people and "rainbowing out" all the time; if you see me out w/ a girl I'm not going to not hug her or hold her hand or kiss her and if the next time you see me out with a girl. ...it doesn't need to be explained. Oddly enough, if there is a girl who's let me know she's interested I pursue like a straight person would in front of other people, I don't feel like hiding it but I don't feel like waving the blue-pink-purple triangle around because men totally mistake that for something that's FOR them exclusively.

Permalink Reply by Kaos Blac on March 17, 2009 at 4:35pm

Yeah I have no idea what my family thinks of me. I went out one day to find that a cousin was in my room playing with my guitar, more than I do, and apparently watching my man porn. I don't think I left my porn viewable when I left my room. I turned on the tv and pop goes the porn. I usually watch then switch back over to tv. Argh. Its so odd, the level of lack of privacy and that somebody know in my family. I have no idea what to do about it.

Permalink Reply by Ladybug on March 17, 2009 at 4:58pm

Yea I really don't get the white people comment...I think every person as a whole...white or black or whatever struggle to come out and exist in this world of ours. I came out pretty young and yes I had problems but took it all in stride. My family didn't talk to me for years but eventually came around. But I didn't stop my life and happiness cause my family decided I no longer needed to be acknowlegded...when I first came out everytime my father saw me he handed me a bible verse...understandable but not needed. I think no matter color you are you will always have either the same or different views on coming out and how you think you should handle yourself in the public or behind closed doors...

Permalink Reply by Boudica on March 17, 2009 at 8:09pm

Hm. I'm so out there's no hiding it. I apparently SCREAM this-girl-ain't-straight. Or at least whistle it obnoxiously. I act just as I am. If someone asks me my sexuality, I'll tell them I'm a pansexual (and then have to explain it) and they can take it or leave it. I feel liberated in that I don't feel the need to hide who I am any more than I feel the need to insert my gayness into every conversation. :)

I am out to the people that matter to me and who I interact with a lot. I haven't told the rest of my family because they live so far away and it's never come up and as I said earlier, while I am proud of who I am I don't need to shout it from the roof tops. If they ask, I'll answer truthfully.

Permalink Reply by osa on March 17, 2009 at 8:20pm

Ewww that's a totally uncomfortable situation. So you just think he watched your porn or did you actually walk in on him watching it? Do you think he put it in cuz he was into it or because he was snooping around? And he's never mentioned it to you since?

Kaos Blac said:

Yeah I have no idea what my family thinks of me. I went out one day to find that a cousin was in my room playing with my guitar, more than I do, and apparently watching my man porn. I don't think I left my porn viewable when I left my room. I turned on the tv and pop goes the porn. I usually watch then switch back over to tv. Argh. Its so odd, the level of lack of privacy and that somebody know in my family. I have no idea what to do about it.

Permalink Reply by blackstardust on June 5, 2009 at 11:31pm

"the white people comment" didn't mean it's not "hard" for them vs. us but rather it was a critique on visibilty and language and who has the freedom to create certain kinds of discourse, like the kinds surrounding "outness" and what that means. historically for many reasons--it's been white folks NOT people of color. this happens in academia, pop-culture and elsewhere [with a few exceptions]

anyway as to the further discussion, like some other people in the thread, i am bi and femme so if i don't open my mouth and say something. people are usually typically, none the wiser. like kaos--my background, family and many of my friends are west indian so i pick and choose, sometimes reluctantly, when certain kinds of discussions will be taking place [if ever]. i also work with kids too in an after school program and try subtly by way of telling them it's not ok to diss someone by saying they're gay and if they are, that's fine, that's who they are etc etc. but many of my co-workers and even my boss are quite religious so i don't even try to broach certain topics.

Ladybug said:

Yea I really don't get the white people comment...I think every person as a whole...white or black or whatever struggle to come out and exist in this world of ours.

Permalink Reply by Suburban Soulgirl on July 10, 2009 at 9:16pm

I am out to friends and associates. Family knows...They think I'm weird anyway and this is just another byproduct of said weirdness.

I am not out @ the job. I work for a very devout Catholic Dr. from India in an area where homosexuality is pretty much frowned upon. I am fine with not being out @ work cos it's irrelevant to my profession and way inappropriate to discuss my personal life on such a deep level.

@ Ladybug- Too often many white LGBT's will easily judge & admonish others for not being 100% out without fully understanding the complexities of the issue. Also- they are quick to point out how rampant homophobia is in POC communities and blames this as the main reason for black/brown queers staying in the closet or being on the DL. (As if white folks outside of NY, LA & San Francisco don't face this issue as well)

Permalink Reply by Satra Sia on July 16, 2009 at 9:51am

To much extra added pressure on being hidden. With some bi people hiding the info from the mate that they tell "I Love You" is not a choice I'd make. If you love someone, feel comfortable enough to tell them any and everything respectfully.

Everyone does have a different situation so it has to be handled accordingly. One associate of mine had her mom ask "Why I always here you talking about girls, never about a boyfriend.? Are you gay?" when she answered "YES" to her church going mom she was told to leave her moms apt. by the end of the month. But it all worked out for the best as she now lives with her woman.

At work is totally understandable. Not everyone needs to know what goes on in your very personal life.
When working with children parents get an alarming feeling that their own child may get thoughts of dating someone of the same sex too. Due to that parents own ignorance they will totally start to place blame, and that's not kool.

I verbally outted myself to my younger sis this year who said she wasn't okay with it but is warming up to it. (Who's opinion I respect but will not lose any sleep over)But I do respect her honesty. Because I'm living for me. My clothes and haircuts spoke for itself in the past but I never was asked flat out. In 2006 I had an argument with my older sis in front of my mom and another older sis about homosexuality being wrong( In her Christian eyes) and told her don't worry about me.. and that was that.

Permalink Reply by Lunakiss on July 19, 2009 at 2:36pm

I'm out online. I'm out among old friends. Most of the new friends I do have are online. I don't have new friends. I'm only out among certain people at work. Being out is a self-own power. It is not a community one. I always encourage people to come out only if it is safe to do so. White LGBTQIA comm are tunneled vision iabout the LGBTQIA movement. They're only moving themselves along while criticizing. It is the reason why certain things are stagnant or in limbo.
By not telling everyone is empowerment not oppresive. I am free b/c I allow myself to be free within the environment that is healthiest to me.
I will come out to my dad (again) as an adult soon. He's already trying to give me away at a wedding. LOL. Now,I know it's time.